Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: It's Aislyn's third time on the podcast and we always have such good conversations. And this time we're talking about booking calls and how you can get better when talking with potential clients.
You're listening to sustainable photography, a podcast all about business tips, inspiration and confidence building. I'm Ingvild Kolnes, the host of this podcast, and after over a decade as a photographer, I now help talented photographers run sustainable businesses. And for full transparency, you should know that I'm a mentor with paid offers, and I will probably mention some of those in this episode.
Hi aislyn. I am so excited to have you here for the third time. And even though it is your third time, I'm still going to have to ask you to let us know who you are in case we have some new listeners.
[00:00:55] Speaker B: Yeah, thank you so much for having me back. I'm always just so excited whenever we get these scheduled because we always have the best conversations and I feel like every single time, it's just such a breath of fresh air. That's how I feel after these conversations. But hello guys, my name is Aslin. I was a wedding photographer for 14 years. I was a luxury wedding photographer, which means I charged above $10,000 for weddings. And before I started my coaching business, I was published in Brides, I was published in Martha Stewart Weddings, I was published in Southern Weddings, and then I moved into coaching in the past couple of years. And since I've moved into coaching, I have scaled to multi six figures over the past few years. And I really do a lot of work helping support women who want to deepen their self trust, who want to scale their businesses and become more magnetic versions of themselves. So I really love having these conversations about sustainable photography because I feel like they really pair well together and go hand in hand around deepening your self trust and also building the systems in your business that actually allow you to trust yourself.
[00:01:59] Speaker A: Brilliant. And I couldn't agree more. Systems is such a key to having a sustainable business. And today we're going to be talking about booking calls. And it's not in all different kinds of photography, but when you're working with clients, especially if it's high end clients, if you do more custom work and you want to make sure that you're working with the right people. Most relationships start off with a call, possibly after sending in a contact form. So what is it about these calls that make them so important? Like, what could we mess up if they go wrong? And how could they strengthen the relationship we have with our clients? If we do them right. That was a long question.
[00:02:44] Speaker B: Yeah, there's like three different questions. So I'll kind of answer the first part of it about why are these so important and what are we using these calls for? So I'll use the word consultation calls. It's interchangeable with a booking call. So I just want you guys to know that now, like, that tiny little language between the two of us, it means the exact same thing. So consultation calls really are this really beautiful space for you to be interviewed by your potential client and for them to also be interviewed by you. So it is a space where you really get to see body language, you really get to see vibes, you really get to see energy, you get to see the way they interact with each other. You get to see the way they engage with each other. This is a really important piece of information to determine whether or not you are a good fit for them and whether or not they are a good fit for you. And I think that there's this common misconception for a lot of wedding professionals that these consultation calls are like you being judged by the client as to whether or not you're worthy of being hired. And that is a mindset that I want you to shift. Right now, consultation calls are the space for you to interview them and for them to interview you. And if you're doing them correctly, it's going to feel a lot better that way.
[00:03:57] Speaker A: I agree so much, and I think that is so common. And I can remember that from a few years ago when I was like, okay, I have a booking call, and what can I do to make sure that they're going to like me and that they're going to want to book me? And then as time went on, after a while, it was like, I don't know if I want to book these people. I need to talk with them and to check and make sure, because I've had the experience of just emailing with people and feeling like, oh, wow, this is the perfect couple. And we're maybe talking a little bit about weddings, but it goes for any kind of photography, just so that said. But I had that feeling before of like, oh, this couple is amazing. We get on really well and then it's time for the booking call. And it's just like, no, we cannot work together. We want completely different things. And you can just tell there's something about the vibe, something about the way that they're communicating with you. And it's just like, you can get a sense of that so much better in that call?
[00:05:00] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I was in the wedding photography industry for 14 years. I did every single type of consultation call. I did phone calls, I did Zoom calls or web calls. I did in person consultations, I did email, I did all of it. And what I can say is that for my own personal energy and the way that I do business, doing Zoom calls was incredibly helpful for me because I could watch the body language cues and I could also watch the micronuanced moments that were happening as we were having the consultation call. And that information really helped me to be able to offer them the exact type of booking offer that they needed based on the conversation, rather than my assumptions or projections about them.
[00:05:47] Speaker A: And I've done the same as you, and I've had those initial meetings in various of different ways. And I do enjoy meeting my couples in real life when that's possible, when they're local. But to me, it just took so much time and it was so draining. And then you spent all this time meeting with someone and it's like, yeah, we're not the best fit. So I as well, went on to just having Zoom calls, nothing else, because you can see them, but you don't have to set aside a whole day to be able to have the meeting. So, yeah, that was such a great way of doing it.
[00:06:24] Speaker B: Yeah, I definitely like Zoom calls, and I always offered my clients, if you want to do a phone call versus a Zoom call, that's totally fine, but my preference is to do a Zoom call.
[00:06:33] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. So back to that whole thing of why does it matter? Why do you think it matters that we have these calls? Like, how can it set you up for having a good relationship? And how can not having them kind of get you in the, kind of steer you in the wrong direction?
[00:06:51] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think personally, with consultation calls, one of the important things about them is gathering information. I want you guys to think about having your little detective hat on of like, I am here to gather as much information as possible so that I can offer them the thing that they need and make sure that they are getting what they need, so that our expectations are on the same page from the start. I can also see how they engage and how they interact with each other and how they engage and interact with someone that they are paying a large amount of money to. Because if there's any weirdness, I'm going to be able to see that in the very beginning, rather than it be like on wedding day, something that I find out later on that there's some kind of dynamic that we could have addressed earlier. And the other thing I think about with consultation calls is just, it really does set you up from the beginning to gather this information that you're going to use throughout the entire planning process and on wedding day to serve your clients better. And truly, to me that is the mission of being a wedding photographer and being like a wedding professional is serving my clients to the best of my ability. And knowing what the best of my ability is, that's what I'm going to produce. And if I don't have all the information, I can't do that.
[00:08:00] Speaker A: And especially when you're getting to know them in that initial call and the things you learn, if you take notes and then you're able to kind of remember things later on, and then that's going to mean so much to them. Like, oh, you remember our dog's name and you remember why we wanted to do this. And it's just a really powerful thing. And a lot can come from that that you wouldn't get from just emailing back and forth because that's going to be all about the essentials and not all the other stuff around it.
[00:08:31] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Because if you're just emailing someone back and forth, you're basically forcing them to only make a decision based on price rather than based on is this a good fit? And that as we get more into luxury service, that's what we need to be doing. Is, is this a good fit? Not can I afford this?
[00:08:47] Speaker A: Yeah, that's so true. But before we get any further talking about the benefits of the calls and how to get the most from them, do you have any advice on actually getting the call booked?
[00:09:00] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So this should just be part of your inquiry process. And I think that's the thing to think about is like, your business is made up of a whole bunch of tiny little processes, and they have to individually run smoothly in order for the entire client experience to feel cohesive. So if we were to look at the inquiry call or the inquiry process, that is its own little process. If we look at the consultation call, that is its own little process. We look at the timeline and logistics meeting. That's its own little process. We look at the engagement session. All of these different pieces have their own process attached to them. So if you are struggling to get people on a call, you need to be thinking about what is my process? Because most of the time people will take things at face value. If you say in order to hire me, you have to get on a call with me, that's your process. People might try to circumvent or they might try to change your process. But if you stand with conviction in this is my process and I did it because I made my process this way because it serves my clients to the best of my ability. It's way easier to stand behind that than just like, oh, I think I'm supposed to get on a call with clients. There's no conviction in that. Versus I am creating this space where we get on a call together because I know that I'm going to be able to serve you better.
There's going to be a lot more conviction behind that and you're going to be able to feel it and your clients are going to be able to feel it. So as far as getting on the call, you need to make it as easy as possible for them to get on a call with you. So if you have a seven step email process before they get on a call with you, you're making it overcomplicated for them to actually get on that call. So if you want calls and you want consultation calls, you need to make it easy and it needs to be part of your process. You need to have a why behind why you're doing it.
[00:10:45] Speaker A: Yeah. I think knowing why you do the different things you do instead of just copying someone else is going to make it so much more powerful. And if your clients are objecting to the way that you do things and you give in, then that relationship is going to be difficult the whole way through because then they're going to be stuck with all the power and then it's going to be harder for you to take control.
[00:11:13] Speaker B: Yeah. And we don't want to give our power away to our clients because they're not the experts.
[00:11:17] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:11:18] Speaker B: They're the experts in their experience. They're the experts in what their wedding is going to be, but they are not the experts in running a business like we're running a business.
[00:11:28] Speaker A: Yeah. And they're trusting you to be that expert, and if you give in, then you're kind of failing your role.
[00:11:36] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, I completely agree with that. Yeah.
[00:11:39] Speaker A: Well, I like that we see things in the same way. That's really fun, actually. But say that I've booked a call now and I'm meeting someone, how can I prepare to get the best possible outcome?
[00:11:52] Speaker B: Yeah. So I tell my coaching clients, and I work primarily with wedding professionals, but I also work with creatives. So that means that sometimes I work with people who are like commercial videographers or like dance studios, or I have a whole bunch of different types of clients. But what I tell my clients is if you're going to be getting on a call and you need to prepare, you should have a document to help you guide the clients through the call. So I actually have two different trainings around this inside of my success accelerator program, which is my signature program. And one of those trainings is about how to get leads from your inquiry all the way through the consultation call. And then the other training is about how to actually do the consultation call. So again, going back to each step has its own process. So when I think about how to actually prep for these calls, I think having some kind of Google document or a process document or some kind of guide that's going to help you and then having some kind of roadmap of what you're going to take your clients through. Because the brain really likes to know what we're doing next. It really likes to know where we're going. So if you can give your clients that roadmap, it will instantly set you apart from other professionals who are just like asking the question during the consultation call of like, well, what do you want your wedding day to look like?
That's not leading a client call, that's asking your clients to lead it for you, basically.
[00:13:10] Speaker A: Would you say this is what we're going to cover today, and this is what you can expect? How would you do that?
[00:13:16] Speaker B: Yeah, so I actually had an entire little speech that I memorized and I wrote it down here so I can give it to you guys. You guys can swipe this if you want to.
[00:13:25] Speaker A: Oh, fun.
[00:13:25] Speaker B: This is what we would say at the very beginning of the consultation calls. So we would say we want to use this time together to make sure that we are a good fit for each other because it's important that you, as the client, feel connection with your wedding vendors. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to give you a little roadmap so that we're all on the same page today. So the first thing that we're going to do is we're going to ask you a couple of questions to get a better feel for your unique event. And then we're going to tell you all about our process and how we fit into your wedding day. And you're going to have so much time at the end to ask questions. And we're going to make sure that you also know your next steps after we talk together and make sure that we are a good fit. We'll make sure you know your next steps. Does that sound good?
So a couple of key things here. We're giving them their next steps. We are making sure they know how the call is going to go, and then we are asking them for a yes. So this is a very good sales psychology tip. You want to get as many yeses as possible from people before the big yes. It's something that I learned this a really long time ago in some sales psychology class that I took. But basically, you just want to get as many yeses as possible. So if you can add these little phrases at the end of the things that you're saying, like, right, does that sound right or sound good, or does that work for you? The way that the question is phrased is asking for a yes. And if you can get them to keep doing that, it's going to make the big yes of, like, are you ready to work together? Way easier for them.
[00:14:49] Speaker A: Do you ask them that towards the end, if they're ready to sign a contract then and there, or do you give them time after? How do you do that part?
[00:15:00] Speaker B: Yeah, every single wedding professional is different. And I'm not going to say one way is better than the other or one way is the only way to do it, because I really think that that's not fair to the individual businesses that we run. What I will say is that for us, the way that I like to do it best was we had a consultation call, and then 48 hours later, we would have a proposal call. So within the next 48 hours. So let's say we did the consultation call on a Thursday. The proposal call would be like Friday or Saturday. So consultation call was to get to know each other, put our detective hats on, gather all the information that we needed in order to create a custom proposal. At the end of that call, we would let them know we have a ten to 15 minutes proposal call to go over your options. That way, if you have any questions in the moment, you can ask them. And so at the proposal call, it'd be like ten minutes where we would show them option one or option two, and then on the proposal call, they would have some kind of booking bonus or some kind of signing bonus for them to quickly make a decision. So it all happened in a short amount of time. But during the consultation call, they were not signing anything or saying yes to anything. They were saying yes at the proposal call, but I didn't take credit card information at the proposal call. It was just like literally showing them their options. And then I would send invoice and contract immediately after got it.
[00:16:21] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, that sounds really smart.
[00:16:23] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:24] Speaker A: Another thing that I think can be maybe a little bit difficult is that tone that you should have during a call, because you see again and again that this is especially for weddings. I don't think this is as much in other industries, but as a wedding photographer, you see that a lot of photographers want to be their client's best friend, and then at the same time, you're also supposed to be professional. So how can you know which direction to take during a call? Like, should it follow whatever your brand is, or should you try to be extra formal? Or how do you know?
[00:17:06] Speaker B: I think it just depends on your business. I know you guys are going to hate that answer, but it really does depend on your business. So as I was getting further into my career, and we were starting to charge $8,000, $10,000, $17,000, as we were getting up there in price, I added more structure into our processes and into our consultation calls. But it was never formal. Like it's like a business meeting and we're in a boardroom. It was never like that. It was more like I have this process that we can flow within and we can create conversation and connection within, but the structure is there to support both of us. So that was part of what I did. And then as far as, should this be more like you're trying to be their best friend versus being formal, I think you're going to have to figure out what your personal brand says. Because I have a personal brand that is both very personal and very deep connection based. But also I'm charging a luxury price for that because I know my stuff and my work is worth that price point. So I think it's really navigating where you are in your business. But also, I will say if you're just sitting there trying to be best friends with your client, one dynamic that might come up from that is codependency. And we do not want to create codependency within our relationships because it's this weird power dynamic that's going to come up over and over again that's going to cause friction, versus if your clients look to you as the expert, they're going to defer to your opinion, they're going to defer to your expertise, versus if they look at you like a friend, it depends on what their relationships with their friends are, how they're going to treat you. So I think it's just keeping all of that in mind. That's a lot to keep in mind. But personally, I would do a mix of both formal structure and also connection and asking really good questions to get the connection going.
[00:19:03] Speaker A: I think that's a really great answer and I definitely agree that it would depend on the branding, like who you already are and how you want to be with your clients. But yeah, some really interesting points there that I hope that the listener will take away from this call because that sounds like a really good idea.
In my program at some stage, we usually have these practice calls where we pretend to do bookings like book with each other. And I've seen this in my own calls from further back as well, that whenever the topic of pricing comes up, it's like just avoided. You look down, you just really talk through it really quickly. So no one really is supposed to hear what you're saying because pricing is hard and pricing conversations can be even harder. So how can we feel confident through talking about what it's actually going to cost to book you?
[00:20:01] Speaker B: So there's a couple of different ways that I want to take this. So the first way is strategy and then the second way is going to be mindset, energy. And that's how I run my different programs and my different coaching is from that standpoint of we need strategy, but we also need mindset and energy. So as far as the strategy behind actually sharing your prices, one of the things that you are going to have to know, and I know you guys are going to hate this, you're just going to be like, aislin, why?
You have to know your numbers.
You have to know your numbers, you have to know your cost of doing business, you have to know what it costs you per client that you book. You have to know what your minimum investment is. You have to know all of these different things in order to ask lots of questions to your client to guide them towards the right package.
Because if you don't know your numbers, it's going to be really hard to sell your packages. It's going to be really hard to sell the different things that you have because you're going to be like, well, I just am making the assumption that this client wants this thing, but if they book that thing, it's going to cost me a lot of money. So I don't actually feel comfortable selling it. So that's the first thing is knowing your numbers in order to kind of get to that next step. And then I think there's this mindset piece around actually understanding that you are doing a service for your clients by knowing your numbers, but also by being able to confidently say this is what I charge and standing behind that, because they are not the experts. They are not the people who know what it costs to run a business. They are not the people that know what a second shooter or what an album costs. All they know is what you're putting in front of them. So if we can confidently say, I charge XYZ, whatever, that is going to be a service to them. And so one of the things that we can do on the mindset, energy side of things for our pricing is once we know our numbers and once we know our pricing that we want to do, you could say to yourself in the mirror, and this might feel weird, and that's okay, go say to yourself in the mirror, I am the type of photographer that charges a minimum investment of $5,000 and just feel, just see where you feel that in your body. Do your shoulders go up? Does your stomach clench? Do you start to break out in hives and cold sweat? How does it feel in your body? Because that's going to tell you where you need to do the work around your pricing. So I think those are two different ways that I would take that is like, you need to know your numbers so that you can confidently say them, but you also can do actual mindset work around it before you get into a consultation call. Even if you have to practice with your dog or you have to practice with your partner or whatever it is, I think it's really important to not be doing that for the first time in an actual call with a potential client.
[00:22:53] Speaker A: Go to englisholness.com shop to find what you need to build your business.
It does feel scary for most of us whenever we increase prices and getting used to talking about prices, that is the best way to deal with this because it's just part of what it is. It's part of running a business. And if you think about it, if you're in a meeting with someone that you want to book, and then when it comes time to talk about pricing, they would just avoid the topic. They would start talking about something else or even sell you the lowest thing they have and just talk about how expensive it is and all their expenses to try to justify the price. That could make you feel so many different things. But I've had that happen where someone has been saying the price and immediately going to, but you can have a down payment plan. And to me it's like, oh, you think I can't afford that?
You should always have your clients best interest at heart and you don't know what they value or what they can afford. So I think that's just something that you have to get over, if I can say that.
[00:24:08] Speaker B: Yeah, I think there's two things there. One of them is other people's bank accounts is not my business.
It's just not. I cannot tell you whether or not my client can afford it because that's not up to me. So if you walk into every single meeting thinking, well, they agreed to my minimum investment, they know my pricing. So now this is just a conversation for us to figure out what's the best fit for them. I think that's going to feel way better than walking into a consultation call and being like, oh, I have to tell them my pricing. They should already know before they're on that call. Otherwise it's a waste of your time and a waste of their time. And then I think the second piece there is just really practicing with people around you. So getting inside of master buttons that talk about money and talk about pricing, getting inside of signature programs, you've got an amazing signature program that has that kind of stuff in it. So getting into spaces where people are talking about money is going to make talking about it feel easier.
[00:25:03] Speaker A: Yeah. And don't practice on your friends or your family who already thinks it's too expensive because then you're going to feel even worse when they go like, oh, that's so much money. How can anyone pay that? You're going to feel just worse about it. So just be a little bit careful about who you choose.
[00:25:20] Speaker B: Practice with your mentor, practice with your business bestie who's charging similar prices to you. Practice with the wall, practice with a mirror. Practice with your dog. Don't practice on the people who are going to be like, that's too expensive. Because until you have conviction, it's going to be really hard to hear somebody say, that's too expensive. If you're like, oh, maybe it is. So if you think someone's going to say that to you, don't practice with them.
[00:25:45] Speaker A: Yes, absolutely.
[00:25:47] Speaker B: Like a mentor is going to say to you, like, oh, you should be charging more.
[00:25:50] Speaker A: Yeah, I know.
That's like the go to for every pricing discussion. I think you need to increase your prices.
What are some common mistakes or pitfalls that photographers tend to do again and again through during calls that you can kind of mention so that we can become more aware of them and hopefully avoid them?
[00:26:14] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So I have a couple here that I think are going to be. It's probably going to hit some of you in the gut of like, oh, no, I do that and that's okay. And I want you to know it's okay. You can be absolutely where you are right now and also move forward in the future with changing things. So the common pitfalls that I see and I want you to start avoiding during consultation calls, number one is letting the clients lead the call. If you are letting your clients lead the call, you are giving your power away. And the purchasing decision is not going to be a mutual purchasing decision. It's going to be based on price, most likely because you are not leading the call as an expert. You are the expert. So you need to lead as an expert. So that's number one. Number two, mistake that I see a lot is answering questions that you don't have an answer to. I see a lot of people, the client will ask them some kind of question and you don't have an immediate answer. You do not have to answer immediately. So they might ask you like a timeline question and want you to sit there for an hour and a half coming up with a minute by minute timeline instead of saying yes to that. Because you don't have to say yes instead of saying yes. What you can do is you can say, that's such an amazing question. We're actually going to talk about that during the timeline and logistics meeting. That's going to happen in a couple of months after you're booked. So what you're doing is kind of like breadcrubbing like that. Hey, yes, we're going to talk about that, but we're not doing that right now. There's no money exchanged. We're not doing that yet. The other thing that you can say to that is I'm going to get back to you with an answer. So let's say you're in a consultation call and the clients have a specific question about some service that you don't have an exact answer right then and there. You can let them know, I'm going to get back to you with an answer on, not after I go check the invoice or check whatever availability, whatever it is. You don't have to answer yes immediately. You can just tell them I'm going to get back to you on that or it's something we'll talk about during this meeting. And then the final thing that I see a lot of people making mistakes around is the follow up. The follow up after the consultation call, they just make the assumption that these people are going to come back and email you and say something. And honestly, as the expert, you just need to have a process and whether or not they email you or don't email you. You need to have a process around this. So I think really just making sure that you actually have a follow up in place is going to be really important.
[00:28:36] Speaker A: Yeah, I think so, too. And I want to talk more about follow ups. But just one thing also came to me when you mentioned these three things. For the first one, you said to take charge of the conversation, lead the conversation. And I could just remember one thing that happened to me once where I didn't do that, where I was too unsure of things and the client just kind of took charge. And what happened was that they were kind of like pushing me to say yes to booking them and I didn't want to book them. And that's another thing that can happen. You're no longer in charge of making those decisions because you're putting them in that position of making the decisions for you. And that is so uncomfortable.
[00:29:19] Speaker B: Yeah, I want to have autonomy and I want my clients to have autonomy to make their choices and for me to make my choices. And so if somebody asks me something that they're trying to get me to say yes to and I don't feel the full body yes for me to actually say yes to it, I'm going to defer and say, we're going to talk about that later, or, that's not something that I do, or I'll get back to you with an answer on that. You do not owe anyone a yes if they're trying to push you into a yes.
[00:29:47] Speaker A: Yeah, that is so important. But follow ups. We need to talk about follow ups because I think, or I know that that is something a lot of photographers just forget about. You've sent an email with a proposal or you've had a call, and then you just wait. But what are your best strategies for actually staying in touch with clients? How do you do things to make sure that you follow up and that you are hopefully getting the response that you want?
[00:30:17] Speaker B: So I think one of the important things is at the very end of the consultation call, letting them know what's happening next instead of just ending the call and be like, I love talking to you about you and your fiance and your dog and the vacation you took last year. That was so fun. See you later. That's a terrible way to end a call. Instead, we want to end a call with like, okay, so I'm going to go over your next steps and let you know exactly what we're going to be doing and what we're going to be sending to you. So you know exactly what we're doing, or that's not the best phrasing, but you guys get what I mean. So if we were to do that, what we would say is essentially like, hey, so here's what's going to happen. You're going to get an email with follow up and call notes from us. You're also going to, and this is assuming we didn't do a proposal call with these people, you're going to get the contract and invoice for the minimum investment that we talked about on the call today. You have x amount of days before that contract expires. And the thing was, for us, we only had certain amounts of spots available. It wasn't based on dates, it was based on spots. So we took on a very limited amount of people, which meant I was selling the spot, not selling the date. So if someone was like, oh, but do you still have my date available? Yes, but I don't have your spot available. So I think that's one switch that we made and then the other switch that we made that really helped was to have a booking bonus that expired 48 hours after the proposal and then having the actual expiration of the proposal itself be like an extra, like five or seven days. So I was not holding on to any spots or holding on to anything. There was always this kind of, like, I don't know how to say this, but there was always this kind of like, there's one date and then there's another date for you guys to make a decision. So I would follow up on those dates and it really helped me to not chase people down, essentially.
[00:32:10] Speaker A: Yeah. That sounds like a brilliant idea. I really love that. It's just important to know that you have to guide your clients. You have to be that expert and you have to tell them what to do. And you also have to take charge. If you don't hear from them, then it's your job to follow up. Okay. So you might think that you're being a nuisance and that you're bothering people, that most people, they really appreciate it. If you follow up, they'll feel so seen. And it's something that I'm sure you can think of a situation where you felt the same as well, where you've forgotten about something. The email has been buried in your inbox like something's happened, and you get that reminder email, and it just means a lot that someone's thinking of you and care enough to follow up.
[00:33:00] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And your follow up emails do not need to be these novels. It could be like two sentences. And I think one of the things that I will say for follow up emails is having a connection point as your first sentence and then having the follow up. So, like, having some kind of, like, let's say this is after the consultation call. I really loved when we talked about your grandmother walking you down the aisle. I have been thinking about that for days after our call, like last Thursday. I just wanted to check in with you and see how everything is going. And if you guys need an additional proposal call to go over the options that you have. Just a reminder, your booking bonus expires tomorrow at X time. If you need extension, reply back to this email. Talk soon. Aslan and William, there you go. You guys go. Copy that and paste it. And I promise you it's going to get some sales for you.
[00:33:49] Speaker A: I love it. I want to talk a little bit more about confidence. How can we be more, well, how can we appear more confident during our calls without it being, like pushy and salesy and just that they can really see and feel that we know what we're doing?
[00:34:07] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I think this is like, take this where you are in your business. If you are six months into your business, confidence is going to feel a little bit shaky, and that's okay. If you are ten years into your business, confidence can still feel shaky sometimes. But having a couple of things in place are really going to help you. And the first thing that you need to have in place is a process. A process that you take every single client through for the consultation call, or at least the structure of a process. And also how you prepare for these calls. Not how your clients prepare, but how you prepare for these calls. So making sure you have water already next to you, you have your little process document or your document that you're going to take people through. Just be prepared for these calls. Don't be driving or on a walk or something and be like, oh, I have a call in two minutes. I should probably get back to my house.
That's not the way we want to lead our consultation calls. We want to lead them with this kind of just very grounded energy. And the way that we do that is by preparing. So that's the first thing I will say. The second thing I want to talk about is actually pushy sales, because I think this is, so many people think that they have to be pushy in order to sell. And I have a completely different viewpoint from this. So pushy sales are going to come from ignoring people's inherent autonomy and choice.
So when you are thinking about sales. I want you to think about the idea that you are offering a choice to the person across the table from you and that all of the choices that you're offering them are a win for you and a win for the client. There is nothing pushy about that because you are honoring your inherent autonomy and choices like, I created these choices and I know they're a win for me. I don't care if they pick package one or package two. It's a win for me either way because I know my numbers and I created these offers and I know they feel good for me and they are a win for that client across the table. I don't care what they pick. I want them to pick the thing that is going to feel good for them. So that is an honor to do that. That is honoring them and it's honoring you, and that's serving your clients at the highest level by expertly guiding them and listening to them. So we want to be active listeners. We want to make sure we're empathetic, but we also want to honor their choice and their autonomy. And if their choice is, I don't want to work with this person, honor that. Absolutely. Honor that. We don't want people hiring us who don't actually want to work with us.
[00:36:33] Speaker A: Absolutely not. No. And my thoughts are exactly the same as yours. That whole, like, we want to stay ethical. We want to be real and genuine and make sure that we can actually give our clients what we're saying that we can. And as you mentioned, listening and empathy, that is crucial to make sure that we can give our clients what they want. Because so often we're so set on like, okay, so I have my packages here. This is what I offer. This is what I can do. And then we might not hear them as to what they're looking for and what they want. What do you think we can do to really improve on how we're understanding what our client needs and wants?
[00:37:19] Speaker B: So one of the things that we can do is ask open ended questions. This is a really great skill to have, is asking questions like, what do you want your wedding day to feel like that's open ended? Because it's not a yes no binary answer. The answer is open ended. It leaves them the ability to say whatever they want to say. So that is one of the things that we can do. Another thing is listening more than you speak. I know this is really hard if we have ADHD brain to listen more than we speak, but I encourage you to practice this outside of your consultation calls, but practice listening to people and listening to what they are saying and listening to the body language that they've got going on. So if you don't already look for body language, that's something you can start doing outside of your consultation calls and then bringing it into the consultation calls, and then also by repeating things back to them that they said is important to them. So you remember how I said we have the little detective hat that goes on during the consultation calls to gather information? So when we put that little hat on, we are gathering information that's important to them. They might not inherently explicitly say, this is important to me, but if you ask questions that lead them to that answer, you're going to be able to repeat back to them. I heard you say during the call that it was really important to you that your grandmother walks you down the aisle because she did that for her daughter, and that's something you want to honor and have this sentimental story about. I would love to know more about what that looks like to you.
That right there, nobody else is going to be asking them that type of question unless it's kind of like getting into the luxury tier of the vendors. So if you can start to ask those questions now, you're going to be able to raise your prices really quickly, I promise. But also just learning these skills of communication and learning these skills of being an empathetic listener and just being an active listener are really going to help you to get the information you need in order to serve them better.
[00:39:18] Speaker A: And do you have any stories, maybe, of someone who's gotten great at having booking calls and then now they're doing so much better in their business?
[00:39:29] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I could tell you my own experience.
[00:39:31] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:39:32] Speaker B: So I told you guys that I was in weddings for 14 years, so I did a lot of different consultation calls over the years, and I was able to book multiple $10,000 wedding clients. And I also did in person sales and had several weddings that ended up in the $17,000 range because of in person sales. But before I really honed my sales skills, I was really stuck in that $5,000 per wedding mark, which is not a bad place to be, but it wasn't where I wanted to stay because I was there for a really long time. And it was like, I know my work is good enough, I know my experience is good enough. What's missing? Sales. Sales. That was the thing that helped me so much. And I've actually had some of my clients have very similar experiences where I had this one client who she was stuck at $6,500 for weddings, and she was there for like three years and she was like, I'm just tired of charging you this price. I think I might need to get out of weddings if I can't charge more than this. And so what we did was we worked on her consultation calls and we worked on her sales skills and messaging and a couple of other things. And she was able to, in a couple of months, book her 1st $10,000 wedding using the consultation call process that I showed her and also the language I showed her. And this is really cool. I just had a client who their wedding or not wedding, but their commercial videography team and the biggest package that they had ever done was $7,000 for commercial videography. They just booked a $21,000 client using the sales and mindset skills that I teach my clients and that we talked about here in this podcast episode. It was so cool because I was right there with them as they were going through the process, and I was like, man, I forgot what it feels like to go from not really knowing what to do during a sales call to being so solid in how you run those calls that you're like, well, of course, if they book me, they book me. It'd be great to book a $20,000 client, but I'm okay if they don't. That is a huge mindset win as well as financial win. So, yeah, I definitely have my own experience and my clients have experience as well.
[00:41:37] Speaker A: Excellent. Yeah, I do think that a whole practicing makes such a big difference as well, because when you're unsure, then it's easy to just talk, talk nervously and not listen. So once you know how it works and you're kind of detached from the outcome and you just know, like, okay, I'm just going to figure out if this is a good fit or not, then that's going to make such a big difference. Rather than like, I have to book this, I have to book it because I don't have any money and I need to book it, then that's not really helping you.
[00:42:09] Speaker B: Yeah, people can feel that energy when you're sitting across from them and you are giving off the social cues of I'm desperate for your sale and I'm desperate for your booking. They can feel that. And most people do not want to be in a relationship with that kind of energy. The people who do want to be in a relationship with that kind of energy are not typically very fun clients to work with.
[00:42:33] Speaker A: No, they are not and as you were saying, if you want to have those higher end clients, then you need to be comfortable with charging that so that you get the people who are comfortable spending that kind of money.
[00:42:46] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's also important, too, as you're getting further into this. Yes, you want to have the confidence and yes, you want to have the process, but also just having the mindset of, I want to book the type of clients who want to work with me and want only me or want my style or my energy or the way I run my business, really kind of getting more into that mindset of, like, if they're not booking me, it's because they didn't really want to work with me and that doesn't have anything to do with me. I think that mindset is so important to kind of adopt as you're getting further in.
[00:43:25] Speaker A: Agreed. Absolutely.
I love that you told us a little bit about your program and your results, and maybe it's intrigued someone listening. So can you tell us a little bit more about how people can find you and work with you?
[00:43:41] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So you guys can find me on Instagram at Acelyn Eileen coaching. So that's where I live and breathe, and I'm there all day, so you guys can find me there, and I'd love to see you. If you do listen to this podcast episode and you come find me on Instagram, please let me know. Come into my DMs. I'll say hello. I've actually had people who come into my world because of our podcast episodes before.
I know. It makes my heart so happy. I was like, oh, my gosh, really?
But as far as ways to work with me, I have a couple of different ways. I have a low cost membership that is just trainings, master classes, and resources. It's an amazing space to start. It's called Clarity Academy membership. Most of my clients end up in my signature program. It's a six month group program that has both a small one on one aspect and also group coaching. So you're actually getting my eyes on your business, and that's called success accelerator program, and it's truly the place if you want to raise your prices, optimize your wedding business, creating new revenue streams, and start to glow with confidence, like, this is the place to be. And I also have spaces for one on one. And I'll be launching a mastermind really soon. But success accelerator program is generally where people end up if they've come to me from a podcast episode.
[00:44:55] Speaker A: Excellent. Thank you so much. I'll be sure to link to your Instagram and to your website in the show notes and yeah, just thank you so much for wanting to talk with me again. It's always so fun having these conversations and I hope we're going to do it again soon.
[00:45:09] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, definitely. I'm really excited. I want to put this on my calendar for at least once, four or twice for this year because I just love these calls so much.
[00:45:18] Speaker A: Perfect. I'm going to be sure to let you know next time I'm recording as well.
[00:45:22] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. All right. I hope you guys have an absolutely beautiful day. Thank you so much for listening to this. I hope that your next consultation call is everything that you want it to be. And just know that there's always room to grow and improve your consultation calls. But you're already doing a really great job.
[00:45:39] Speaker A: Thank you so much, Aislin. Thank you.
[00:45:41] Speaker B: Thank you.
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