Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: You're listening to episode 161 of Sustainable Photography. I'm your host, Ingrid Colness, and today I have Renate and Manuel Mattsson with me. The first ever episode with two people as guests. And I am just so excited to have this conversation. I know Renate quite well. We've been working together before and she is just such an amazing photographer and her husband Manuel is a videographer. And I think just the dynamic of two people who know each other so well and work together doing something that's very similar but also quite different is going to make a really interesting conversation because they both have really good ideas of what it takes to collaborate as a photographer, videographer during a wedding. So that's what this conversation is going to be all about.
[00:00:56] Speaker B: Foreign.
[00:00:58] Speaker A: You'Re listening to Sustainable Photography, a podcast all about business tips, inspiration and confidence building. I'm Inguil Kolness, the host of this podcast. And after over a decade as a photographer, I now help talented photographers run sustainable businesses. And for full transparency, you should know that I'm a mentor with paid offers, and I will probably mention some of those in this episode.
Thank you so much for being here with me today, Renate and Mana. I am so excited because today this is the first episode with two guests because we're going to be talking about videography and photography and how the two can work together during a wedding and how the focus is different. So welcome.
[00:01:48] Speaker B: Thank you so much. Thank you for having us.
[00:01:50] Speaker A: Yeah. So excited. Can you just tell me or us listening a little bit about the two of you?
[00:01:57] Speaker B: I'm going to let you go first.
[00:01:59] Speaker C: Yes. I'm Renate and I'm the photographer of this husband and wife duo.
[00:02:06] Speaker B: Yeah, and I'm the husband and videographer as well.
[00:02:12] Speaker C: We've been married for six, seven years now and I've been a photographer for, I think maybe 13 years or so. You've done sound engineering?
[00:02:25] Speaker B: Yeah, I started with sound engineering and now I just went with, yeah, the big boom hit with the COVID thing. So I had to do a pivot and jump into the videography thing and realized that, yeah, the wedding thing was just a really cool thing to work with.
[00:02:42] Speaker A: And you both do other things besides wedding as well?
[00:02:46] Speaker B: It's a part of the revenue. It's a very important part of the revenue, obviously, but it's not the only thing.
[00:02:54] Speaker C: No, I do real estate photography as well, for the most part. And yeah, some business as well. And you do some.
[00:03:02] Speaker B: I do some infomercials and commercial things and a lot of content. Creating as well now, just going out and capturing moments and posting it as reels for people sounds easy, but it's not.
[00:03:18] Speaker A: I don't think it sounds easy at all. Like, I can't even do my own, like, B roll shots so that I have something to put out as reels.
[00:03:25] Speaker B: Oh, it's so much easier to just hire someone to do it.
[00:03:27] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:29] Speaker C: Enter.
[00:03:31] Speaker A: Yeah, perfect. Perfect. But I want us to talk about weddings, because I know for weddings, a lot of people think like a photographer, that's a given. But a videographer, that's not as common. So. So I want to address that, but I also want to talk when it comes to.
For photographers, not that many photographers are used to working with a videographer, and there are some obvious pitfalls. I know that I've certainly had my share of collaborations that didn't really work out, so I want to talk about all that stuff. But I also know when you're a photographer and when you're a videographer, your focus, your emphasis, the way that you work is very different. Do you want to talk about how you work as a photographer, how you work as a videographer during a wedding day and how it's different?
[00:04:23] Speaker B: I mean, we can start with saying that we had a lot of talks in between us, ourselves, which was a really good learning curve for me, especially because, like you said, the photography business has been so established for such a long time here in this area. And obviously, because video is so new for people, it's just like a last thought, oh, maybe we should have a video as well. So it kind of puts it into perspective of how people see their investment being prioritized. And, yeah, that makes a huge difference when you get there on the day.
[00:05:01] Speaker C: And I was just thinking that in advance. We need to have a lot of communication as well. I have done quite a few more weddings than you have, so I wanted to. When I brought you along and you wanted to start doing video, it was really interesting to get another person's point of view because I only had worked with one videographer before that and only at one wedding as well. So it was new to me too. And we had to figure out different things and making sure that it wouldn't be a bad experience for the couple, number one. So there has been a lot of troubleshooting. Yeah, I can say.
[00:05:42] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, you have a lot more experience with the weddings and everything. And obviously there's very few weddings where there's just a videographer and no photographer. But the other way around is more common, obviously.
[00:05:53] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:54] Speaker B: Which makes it like, as a videographer, I feel like I want to come in as non interruptive for the photographer who's already had their mind set up on what's. What the day is going to be like. Yeah, but like, you're not to say, like, for us, it's the thing that we came to conclusion with was that the most important thing for us was to document the memories and the moments for the couple.
So we put them on a pedestal, so to speak. And it was that mindset which led us through the whole thing. So it wasn't about my film or her photos. It was actually what we could do for the couple.
[00:06:34] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think that sounds like a very healthy and productive way to do it. Because, I mean, talking about two people who are working together as a team, that would be quite different than if you're working with just a more or less random videographer and a photographer that you might not know. So how would you then approach the situation where you can work together without getting in each other's sway more like as a photographer and videographer, like that you don't know someone random.
[00:07:07] Speaker B: The thing is that I would like to address is that I think I was pretty lucky to be able to experience the first steps with my wife because we obviously talked about things and it got to the point where we actually had almost like a beef on the whole thing because it was. We had such different thoughts on it. And if this would have happened with somebody else, it would have been really awful. I guess it would be awful for one part at least. So getting that experience firsthand with my wife was just very helpful for me.
[00:07:38] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:07:39] Speaker B: Because the experience of working with other photographers was that I was obviously always referring to her as a reference point, which made it more clearly for me. Like, what is she doing better than other people, maybe, or different.
[00:07:53] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:07:54] Speaker B: Then that taught me how to adapt to those things and see from a different perspective. That made it more efficiently, basically for me to work on a wedding day.
[00:08:04] Speaker C: Because your mindset is also, like, you don't want to get in the way. Like the. The photographer is like the main person. Although you have had couples being like, we want video as number one.
[00:08:17] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. Yeah.
[00:08:19] Speaker C: So, but it's. Yeah. In your. In our case, I usually do the directing and like leading and you just follow and like documenting. Yeah, alongside.
[00:08:33] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. I mean, we came down to like communicating the whole thing beforehand. Like, okay, certain situations where we have like the couple walking out of the church maybe, or the ceremony, then we often have the little Talk about, okay, what kind of lens are you going to be using for this situation?
So we can move along side to side so we don't bump into each other's footage? Basically.
[00:09:01] Speaker C: Yeah. One is like wanting to get really close, the other one wants to get far behind.
[00:09:06] Speaker B: So it's really hierarchy. I mean, I'm asking her, what kind of lens are you going to be using? So I can adapt more than I'm telling her. I'm gonna be on a 200 millimeter, so get out of the way.
[00:09:19] Speaker C: I usually get to do what I want.
And then you adapt to me, which I'm really grateful to.
[00:09:26] Speaker B: And that was kind of freaky when I started working with other photographers because I was so used of the dynamic that we had. And obviously it was not the same with other people.
So when it came down to that. Yeah, again, I learned a lot of. About what to be communicating beforehand with other photographers.
[00:09:45] Speaker A: Right. So as a videographer, how does it work? Like, what is important for you so that you can do your job and get the results that you're looking for? Because I've heard that it's just so different, like in terms of like the movements and like everything. So do you want to explain so that all the photographers out there can hear like, this is what you have to be careful of.
[00:10:08] Speaker B: Well, it sounds weird maybe, but for me, video needs a lot of space. A lot of space. I mean, it's kind of hard to push yourself into a corner and get something usable. You need to be able to move around according to my kind of things that I'm doing. So I want to have like as much space as possible available. And then the technical side of it is up to each videographer how they want to work with this stuff. Right. But for me, being on manual settings on everything, I need to adjust everything at all times and that. Yeah, especially when you have like multi camera setups for a ceremony or something like that, or toasts. I mean, that's at least three cameras on different points in the room. And then you have. Yeah, you have to sync everything up in post or using timecode. And then you have to check the batteries and everything so it works. And then you have microphones on. Yeah. In the room. And you have the microphones on maybe the people who speak in the toast. And if they're having a microphone in the. And the PA system and venue, then you have to have the right settings for that as well.
[00:11:09] Speaker A: I'm already dizzy listening to this. I mean, it's insane.
[00:11:13] Speaker B: Yeah. So you have to have all these things at all times. And then somebody always comes up like, oh, can you help us with the projectors? And the. Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure.
[00:11:21] Speaker C: He'll be the tech guy.
[00:11:22] Speaker B: Yeah. So you like the Norwegian potato thing, Expression.
[00:11:26] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. And you're saying, like, you do everything like manual. Like, we shoot manual as well as photographers, most of us. But you have to. You can't just like, change the ISO or change like shutter speed during like a clip. You have to, like, use your ND filter. Filter, yeah.
[00:11:45] Speaker B: On and off. On and off.
[00:11:46] Speaker C: Yeah. So it's like a whole different thing, like working with the camera as well.
[00:11:52] Speaker B: Yeah. Because you have like, the settings are really set.
[00:11:55] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:11:55] Speaker B: I mean, you can turn it around and also say, like, it's easier because I always set my cameras to a setting. It's a fixed F stop, fixed shutter speed or shutter angle and a fixed ISO. And then I just turn the variable ND filter. Variable ND filter. And that's the only thing I'm actually working with.
So luckily for me, I have the dual native ISO. But so the equipment is very. Yeah, I've been doing what I'm doing because of the equipment, basically.
[00:12:25] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:12:25] Speaker B: But there's a lot of things, technical things to think about in video. Basically. There is.
[00:12:29] Speaker C: And your style also has a lot of handheld shooting and also using the manual, the focus. So that's a bit different as well. Anytime I use my tilt shift lens and I have to go manual focus, I'm like, I'm turning. Silence. So when I'm speaking and communicating with the couples and suddenly I'm just like, sorry, I'm going to be quiet for a while now. I'm just like so focused to get it right. So I wouldn't handle doing film myself.
[00:13:03] Speaker B: But I have had a lot of help as well from Renate when doing these toasts and everything. Because obviously you place microphones and tripods with cameras on the most stupid places in the venue because you don't want to get in the way for the people who are sitting there. Right. Yeah. The saddest thing would be for somebody to having to see the camera equipment the whole evening, I guess. So I thought, okay, I'd rather just put it somewhere really tricky and dumb. And then having to. Yes.
Just to get to those places, it's sometimes really tricky. But then you come up with all these MacGyver things. It's always really fun for me because I like those kind of things. Suction cups and, you know, like these little clamps everywhere.
[00:13:50] Speaker A: So you have to Be creative.
[00:13:51] Speaker B: Very creative, technically. Yeah.
[00:13:53] Speaker A: Yeah. Because the way that you explain it, you say that, okay, so Renate, the photographer, she gets her way, and then you just follow along. But from, like, an outside perspective, I would think, like, okay, so if I'm the photographer and the videographer kind of gets in my way, I can just take another photo. Like, just. I don't know. If he just moves past my lens, I can still save it because I can just take another photo. But if it's the other way around and you're doing a video clip and then the photographer gets in your way, you can't really use it, so.
[00:14:24] Speaker B: You're absolutely right. Yeah.
[00:14:26] Speaker A: So how does that work? How do you not get in each other's way?
[00:14:29] Speaker B: Well, that's where the three cameras comes into place. I always have a backup of the backup angle, basically. No, but we have the dynamic, like I said, when they're not taking the wheels on the whole thing and posing and deciding what's gonna happen, grouping up people, who's gonna be taking the group photo, communicating with everybody, like, what it's gonna be done and everything. Because you have such a. More. More coordinating role in the wedding than I do.
[00:14:58] Speaker C: Yeah. And I know how I want certain things to go, and I know what works.
[00:15:04] Speaker B: I'm very comfortable following that as well.
[00:15:07] Speaker C: I think many videographers are. They like to get it from that point of view.
[00:15:13] Speaker A: Yeah. So what if you don't work with Renate? What if you work with a different photographer? How is that different in terms of, like, you getting the things that you need without getting in the way of the photographer? And how can a photographer, in a better way, collaborate with a videographer?
[00:15:31] Speaker B: Well, I think a huge lesson I had with Renata was the time it takes to get the natural feeling footage for me. So there's some situations where there's couples who are very dependent on the posing, directing from the photographer. So as soon as Renate speaks with them, they do what they're supposed to do, and very static. And then as. As long as she's happy with the photo, they turn to her and look for confirmation, basically.
Which leads me for no space to get any natural movements or anything like that in the video. So what I found out was, like, I really like the.
The clips in between the posing, so I get those. So, yeah, Renate was letting me take that extra time. After we spoke about it, I said to her, like, I need more time, basically. And that's something I learned from her and what I'm trying to communicate to Other photographers as well, that just, like, do your thing, and I promise you I'll ask if I need something else. So learning the photographer's way of posing and working has been a benefit, obviously. But then the next thing was just, okay, I know when I have to step in and I'm not just jumping in and telling the couple and also do this or run that way or do something like that, I'm actually going to, first of all, go to the photographer who's doing the posing and everything and ask the person if they could actually communicate with the couple that we need to do this as well.
[00:17:06] Speaker A: Oh, wow. Okay. That's a really good way of doing it.
[00:17:08] Speaker B: Yeah. Because I think that in my mind, it can be disturbing for the couple who's in a very tricky situation, and then just having a lot of directors.
[00:17:20] Speaker A: Yeah. Because we have to remember, like, what you said, that's your key. Thinking that it's their day, so they can't just be props in our shoots.
[00:17:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Not for us, at least. Not for us.
[00:17:35] Speaker C: And it helps being humble as well, because you are very, like, easy to work with. Like, I know other photographers who have said the same thing as well, within the same impression that he's easy to work with. He adds good. Like, you're more like the fun guy coming with, like, bad dad jokes. And that's me just getting, like, good vibes. And I think that's a good asset to a photographer. And no matter who gets to be in charge, either if it's the videographer or the photographer, in our wedding, we had both videographer and photographer, but the videographer was the one taking the control, so that was a whole different thing. And then we haven't even done a wedding together then when we got married, so that was a whole new thing for us. But we. We thought it worked excellent. And they hadn't worked together before either.
[00:18:35] Speaker B: We just let them do their thing. I mean, we were kind of busy with us.
[00:18:38] Speaker C: Yeah. Not sure how it actually went behind the scenes. Like, we don't know. We haven't talked to them about that, but it seemed really good then. So it can be, like a really good combo. And I guess communication is, number one, always key.
So the more you can talk about your thoughts and views beforehand, I think that's a good thing. And if there are certain shots you need to get and you want to. If that's your style and that's what you need, you don't have a preference of. You have some few shots you need to do. But I think in Other cases, people might have more like a specific style or I want this or this, this is how I. You recognize it's my film or my photos and really allow the other person to also get what they need without getting in each other's way.
[00:19:38] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But the whole thing with getting each other's way has been like a huge, huge experience thing for me with different photographers. I mean, I've been working with some people who is just like, because of the nature of how they're working, it just leads the day to be without time for doing the video.
So it's like.
And that's also like, because I haven't communicated on the time schedule and everything with the couple. Maybe because it's been like, okay, the photographer is taking the, the lead on this one. And yeah, because of that, it might just end up with being almost like the video is like a complement to the pictures just by being in movement, basically. But if it's a lot of posing and everything, it's not going to be anything fun to watch. So.
[00:20:25] Speaker A: So you're missing the story kind of like the storytelling aspect of it. Then if you don't get what you want.
[00:20:30] Speaker B: Basically what I'd really like to get is the natural things that the couple can look back in is like, I did not do that pose wrong. I did not do it right. It was just us being us.
So that's the kind of approach that I like to have. And with other photographers it's been more like, what can I say with.
Yeah, we had, I had. This one situation was really funny because there was two photographers and two videographers. So it's a big crew, basically.
And obviously you're gonna get in each other's way.
[00:21:06] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:07] Speaker B: Especially for big moments and everything. And it's hard to communicate everything if you're not on the same team, basically.
[00:21:13] Speaker A: That's true. Yeah.
[00:21:15] Speaker B: But the mentality that we spoke about later that evening was just like, but if we're doing this for the couple, at least they're going to get like a really cool shot from the video or the photo.
So we're covered in the sense if we, if we try to work it together for the couple instead of thinking, oh, I also want to have that, like it's my thing.
[00:21:37] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:37] Speaker B: So, yeah, putting ourselves aside to the whole thing, just thinking about like what they're going to be sitting left with, the couple they're going to be left with in 10 years time, then it makes it a little bit easier to just go ahead and chill out a little Bit more.
[00:21:52] Speaker A: Yeah. But it does sound like, overall, it is more challenging to work with someone who you're not, like, on a team with because you're not so used to working together. And the communication probably requires a lot more upfront so that you're agreeing as to how you can both get what you need. So from a couple's perspective, booking someone who is used to working together, that sounds like an obvious thing to do.
[00:22:22] Speaker B: I think so, yeah. I mean, a lot of.
[00:22:24] Speaker C: To us, it's obvious.
[00:22:25] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:22:26] Speaker C: But it's not to the couples.
[00:22:28] Speaker B: No.
[00:22:29] Speaker C: In our case, most of my couples are reaching out long before they even consider a videographer.
[00:22:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:22:39] Speaker C: Some are like, two years in advance. We're gonna have both, but then they're very clear of it. But usually, yeah, I'm booking out more in advance than you are.
[00:22:49] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, definitely.
[00:22:50] Speaker C: Because, yeah, people are laid back with video. They will see what. What's within our budget when the time comes. They're more like that. And. Yeah, but it's such different mediums as well, so you can't really compare them as people think, like, okay, we have photos. We don't need video. And it's just not comparable.
[00:23:13] Speaker B: At least that's what they say. Until their friend gets a video.
[00:23:17] Speaker C: Yeah, definitely.
[00:23:18] Speaker A: Yeah. Because it is getting more common to have a videographer as well. So, I mean, the more common something is, the more people want it. Like, the more of your friends have it, the more you're going to want it to. So it seems like it's like a niche that's growing.
[00:23:36] Speaker B: Yeah. I got the impression of a lot of people that. That book me that in the beginning, there was a lot of people who just wanted to try out something new and they had the means to actually try it out and take a risk, even though it was a full day paid to another people. Another person. Right. So when it comes to, like, the budget thing, I think it also has to grow into people's minds in a sure way because, I mean, I'm not sure it's. It's so common for people to think that, yeah, we're just gonna add, like, the cost of another photographer plus, plus, and I think it's gonna be like, maybe cutting down on something else that's gonna lead to the. To a bigger change.
[00:24:18] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:18] Speaker B: Because right now it's just like, a lot of people are just discussing that we don't have the economy to do it, they say.
And. But they still say, like, if they won the lottery, obviously that's something they would prioritize yeah, of course. But then again, we have all these things with flowers. We have the dresses, we have the venues.
[00:24:36] Speaker A: Multiple dresses.
[00:24:37] Speaker B: Yeah, multiple dresses, all these things. And when we get to the wedding day, me and Renata, we see all these things and maybe had a couple who was discussing on price and then seeing all the other expenses, we go, oh my God.
And the only thing they're going to be left with after this is actually memories of the photos and the video and still like the food and everything was much more prioritized that evening. Yeah, everything goes hand in hand, obviously.
But yeah, if you're doing this wedding once and you planning it and everything and doing all these things to get the perfect day, I think it's well worth to consider having.
Yeah. Consider that investment, basically.
[00:25:18] Speaker A: Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I see that so often as well, how preoccupied people are with all the stuff, the flowers and the colors and all the things. And they don't necessarily think about the fact that when it's all over, you're just left with the photos and the memories again. I think that goes back to more or less like a traditional thing where it's like that's what everyone does. That's how you're supposed to do it. And people don't think, stop and think like what. What does actually matter to me or to us? And that's a shame.
[00:25:54] Speaker B: Yeah, I completely agree.
But it's a cultural thing. I mean, watching YouTube as a nerdy videographer obviously is. I see these weddings in Philippines where they have like, it's a crew of maybe seven, eight members. And that's a regular wedding. That's what I heard. And these cool like new things with same day edits. So they present like an edit during the thing, the thing that they film during the day, they're presenting it and at the evening, so somebody sitting in the closet just editing away while the other people are filming and they have like runners and everything. Like it's a proper crew. Right.
You have that kind of culture and then you have the other one, like American everything, it's just like elopements and stuff like that. It's so much more like common thing to invest in. And like you said, when it gets into their veins and you just feel like, okay, that's one of the first things we need to get instead of choosing what menu it is.
[00:26:50] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I couldn't agree more. When I do elopements, most of their budget is photography. That's like it's fine to spend like $10,000 on a photographer, but especially in Norway and Scandinavia. It's like, yeah, it's just like a thing that you. It's not as bad as it used to be. Before it was almost like just a thing on a checklist. But now it is more like you put more thought into it and you look for the one you want and you want them to be there all day. But it still feels like it could be so much more. Especially adding on videography as well.
[00:27:25] Speaker C: Definitely. And when we got married as well, that was in 2018, I didn't even consider video as well. It wasn't really that common. But you were the one who's like, we need video.
[00:27:38] Speaker B: Yeah. If I'm gonna get anything out of this day, I want a video.
[00:27:40] Speaker C: Yeah, that's what I thought. So we like, we were searching for the right ones. I.
I looked at. We. We searched a lot for good videographer and we ended up with an Australian guy. So we had to. We didn't send him from Australia because he was working in Sweden. He was married with a sweet. So he was there during summertime. So we got lucky there. But there were. We were through a lot of other videographers that I was like, this is cheesy. This is so awkward. I don't want to be doing that. And I feel like maybe some people think of it that way. Either that it's too like, cliche or like, yeah, bad, badly done. I don't know. Doesn't look as professional.
[00:28:29] Speaker A: I think you're right because there's not that many videographers around here. Like there is a handful and now it's getting more. But just a few years ago, like you said, there was. There was no one and, and, or the ones that were there, they're like, who wants this?
[00:28:44] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:28:44] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:45] Speaker B: That was a kind of a pre Covid impression I had as well. Like when I started out with video in total, it was just like, oh my God, there's so much people who just don't want to be recognized as a wedding videographer. That was like, you don't want to. That's. That's a bad mouth thing to say. Like.
[00:29:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:02] Speaker B: Then I watched a lot of other people who's doing it in the States and everything. It was just like more inspiring to see that there was a cool vibe to it.
[00:29:09] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Because one thing is like how you shoot and what you capture and how you like to do that. But another side to it is the post production. I would imagine that most of like what you're left with and how Cool. Or how lame it looks is down to that.
[00:29:28] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, I have my hardest critic here, which is really helpful. If it turns out not to be, like, the vibe that she recognizes, it's gonna be heard.
[00:29:45] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:29:45] Speaker B: Which is a good thing.
[00:29:46] Speaker C: I'm not going easy on you when I'm giving you feedback.
[00:29:49] Speaker B: No, no.
[00:29:49] Speaker C: It's really good because it's. That's the most important thing. Like, the final result.
Making the people know the couple feel like it's their film. And we've had very similar values on that. And we both want, like, very fun energy during the day. We want a lot of smiles, laughter. There are very different videographers and photographers as well. Some people like it more staged, some people are more melancholic. And, like, there are so many different ones. I feel like we have come to, like, a more similar style.
[00:30:25] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:30:25] Speaker C: And we were like, we want the party people.
So when we came to terms on that, it was, like, so easy getting a cohesive result, if I may say so.
[00:30:36] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely.
[00:30:37] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:30:37] Speaker B: And that also showed me a lot when looking at your pictures and the couples you had and why they were booking you. And, I mean, a lot of people say to the notes, like, we want to book you because of this and this and that.
So listening to that, it was like, okay, that I almost got the impression that everybody was booking because of those things. But then we realized that this is actually the marketing side of it that she's been doing. She's only been putting out those kind of good vibes and that kind of style. So it just came naturally.
[00:31:07] Speaker A: Yeah. Is it the same for you, though, with videography, that you put an emphasis and only share the stuff that has that happy vibe?
[00:31:14] Speaker B: Not really. Because, I mean, first of all, I've been bad in marketing. But second of all is, like, that Renate actually has a lot more weddings, so you get more of a. I think, for me, I get the impression of her vibe and style much easier because of the so many weddings. I don't have that many weddings, so it feels like the things that I want to show other people is the fun weddings, the funniest moments, and everything are different for different people. So when it comes, like, I mean, a wedding is really a touchy subject. It's very, like, delicate for a lot of people. It's a very meaningful day. So I think that all the elegance and the love thing for me comes automatically just by being a wedding film. So what I try to add into it is a different kind of dimension. So to Speak and is trying to add all these fun parts, like having pop music, having these like different transitions. It makes you feel like, oh my God, am I here? Is this a wedding or is it just like a big party?
[00:32:12] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:32:13] Speaker C: And maybe a fun comment or making people laugh.
[00:32:16] Speaker B: Just like people roasting each other, you know, back and forth and just saying shit about each other. And I feel like that's something that it's going to set like a different vibe. So you go back and forth between crying and laughing than just having this. For me, I know that people want these elegant, really slow motion, cool films as well. Looks very cinematic and all these words that they're kind of using. And I just felt like it was not something that I wanted to strive for.
[00:32:47] Speaker A: Yeah, because I mean, if you think about photography, there are so many different kinds of vibes. So many different kinds, like, ways of doing it. You can have everything from like really dark and moody cinematic, or you can have the fun and vibrant. But it would be the same for videography. Like your vibe, your style, your way of telling stories has to shine through because if not, it's probably not going to be very genuine and you're not going to enjoy it very much if you're just doing something enforcing this cinematic slow motion thing where it's like, yeah, that's really not me at all.
[00:33:21] Speaker B: No, exactly. I mean, there's a lot of people who want that kind of film and there's a lot of videographers who can actually offer that. So I'm really cool with it, so to speak. But when it comes to like people who wants to have like a. Maybe the couple takes a shot and that's like in the opening 15 seconds of the film.
[00:33:41] Speaker A: Yeah, that's fun.
[00:33:41] Speaker B: When you have like, okay, we see where we are, the establishment of the place, and then we have like the vibe set directly on what they're doing. What are these kind of people about? Yeah, and so we talked about this when it comes to editing as well. Like, it's much. It's so different to think about how to build up a sequence because you're so depending on the other clip that you're going to be using after and before and after that and after that, like the whole sequence. But yeah, so it's a kind of storytelling thing. But I'm not thinking about it as a storytelling thing. I'm just thinking about it as sequences.
[00:34:14] Speaker A: Yeah, because that's very different in photography. In photography you can still have a great shot without there being anything before or after.
[00:34:23] Speaker C: Definitely it's like a split second and it doesn't matter what happens after.
[00:34:28] Speaker B: It's an art of itself. The photo is like, this is the picture, this is the moment. We're gonna cherish this whole thing as it is and have memories around that. Yeah, but in video you have to tell the memories around, basically and you.
[00:34:43] Speaker C: Get a whole other, like a different view of or another perspective of yourself, of your guests, of the vibe of the day. Everything is like. It's suddenly so real in a whole different way.
As I say, I'm documenting, but I'm enhancing the real deal.
But with video it's like that's what happened. You can see different sequences.
[00:35:09] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:35:09] Speaker C: You can do a lot with editing, cutting real quick. And it doesn't have to be long sequences, but when you do get those great sequences over a few more seconds and get like the actual facial expressions moving. Maybe your great grandfather and grandmother, great.
[00:35:31] Speaker B: Parents and everything, or the kids were young and everything. And you look back in that in 10 years time. It's just a different vibe.
[00:35:38] Speaker C: Yeah. Even looking at my phone, like how my daughter acted when she was like 2 years old versus the photos, it's not comparable. So that's like a really good thing to look at it.
[00:35:51] Speaker A: Yeah.
I mentioned in the last episode that I had started to make something in Norwegian for Norwegians, the Photographers Academy. And the very first offer that we have, there is going to be a beginner's course. A course. Course for photographers who are new to their business, maybe who haven't started their business yet, maybe who've had their business for a little while but still have quite a lot to learn. That's what this very first course is all about. It's planned to be launched in the end of February. So if all goes to plan, that's what you can find there. Go to my Instagram Ingelkulness if you want to learn more. More about how I might be able to help you with your business. And of course, if this new course in Norwegian is for you.
[00:36:47] Speaker B: But yeah, the editing part of the whole thing with video is a big difference when we see like the time being spent on it.
[00:36:55] Speaker A: Oh, okay.
[00:36:56] Speaker B: Yeah, I get pretty jealous if not this workflow when it comes to that. But I also know that I'm very, very slow when it comes to editing. I'm so afraid of missing out on some moments.
I have this big FOMO of cutting something out and just like even if it's there in hard drive.
[00:37:17] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:37:17] Speaker B: I feel like it's gone because there's so Much things. I mean, I'm sitting there with four hours of material which is going to be compressed into six minutes.
[00:37:28] Speaker A: I think that feeling is something that I know a lot of photographers struggle with as well, like spending a lot of time on culling. And I understand it from a creative perspective, but from like a business standpoint and just to get it done and delivered. Your clients, they don't know what you have.
So I understand the feeling. But it's really frustrating because then you just, I imagine would just sit there and just like, I don't know what to do. Do you feel like it could get paralyzing?
[00:38:00] Speaker B: It does. I mean, it's like making your own short film, I guess when you have full creative freedom, it just sets the boundaries to be infinitive.
[00:38:09] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:38:10] Speaker B: And it makes it tricky. I mean, you have to set your own boundaries to like, okay, I have an hour, let's go.
[00:38:17] Speaker A: That's a good way of doing it.
[00:38:19] Speaker B: Just trying to do everything in that time and everything. But it's still very tricky to get that and feel comfortable that this is somebody's. This is somebody's memories you're working with for the future.
[00:38:32] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:38:32] Speaker C: And also that's like really weird because your day is definitely harder in a sense because you have so much more technical stuff to worry about.
Yeah, sure. We, myself, I do the directing and I do a lot of like the communication and setting up, like where we should be at what time. But you have like all the technical stuff, like if that goes wrong, it's wrong so you can pick that up again. And also after with editing and everything, it takes a lot more time. I don't know if there are a lot of videographers who could do that very fast. But at least it takes, it's more with the coloring and everything after it's more.
[00:39:24] Speaker B: Much more work to do. You have so many different areas.
[00:39:27] Speaker C: Photography has come to a point where like we can take a certain amount of money for our work. But I feel like it's more like even if you haven't done video for as long, it takes such a long time and it's not like really valued at the same, at the same point as photography. So people don't understand like they should be charging like double at least for the same amount of time they're working on one wedding. So.
Yeah, it doesn't really add up in my opinion.
[00:39:59] Speaker A: No, that's what I've heard as well. Like videography sounds like it's really under priced and if that has to do with how people Appreciate it. Or if it's just videographers in general being a little bit scared of raising their prices to the level that it's at. I don't know. I don't know if you've any. If you have any thoughts around that.
[00:40:21] Speaker B: Well, yeah, certainly on, like, being more efficient in the work. Workflow process, I think there's a lot of things you can gain on. On being more structured and figuring out your style and how to do all these things. But it's not something that resonates with me because, I mean, with people who ask me, okay, can we have music like this or something like that? In the beginning of the process, I'm going to tell them, I'm gonna have to see your wedding first before I can change, before I can decide on what kind of music, what kind of vibe, what kind of tempo it's gonna be. I have no idea until the wedding has been done.
[00:40:55] Speaker A: But I love that approach because it makes it seem very genuine. It's not like you're just trying to fit it into, like, this is the template that I've got. You are a present first, and then you're. It sounds like a real artistic process.
[00:41:11] Speaker B: Yeah. But I think that it's kind of hard for people to recognize it as an artistic process as well if you put into relation to the economics, obviously.
So if you. If you think about, like, having a couple who wants something that they've seen on Instagram, obviously that's highlights, and they want to have that kind of vibe and everything, and maybe it's a videographer or a team that has, like, a template and it just suits them perfectly fine. You've done it. But I think that because of the pricing, I think it's just going to be the videographers making a bigger margin in those cases. They're not going to sell cheaper because of that.
And also because of how new it is in this area, I think people are just gonna not understand that you can have different vibes depending on how much you pay for it, I think, because it's hard for people to recognize what is the thing we're paying extra for.
But, I mean, I would love to raise my prices, but just to get more in the zone of, okay, I have this time to do this, it's actually worth everything. I'm doing it mostly for the couples, but if I would have been paid much more, I think it would be different, and you would think more creatively in a different sense.
[00:42:28] Speaker A: But what do you feel is stopping.
[00:42:30] Speaker B: You at this point? I think it's just like the impression I have of the market.
I see that there's some videographers who are actually doing this on a big scale in Scandinavia. There are a few of them. But it's really cool to see that they have found their thing to go all the way with it. And obviously it's not the small out of town weddings we're talking about. It's like more people who come from a different kind of budget when it comes to the weddings and everything. So there's fewer of them.
And to be honest, I'm not sure if it's gonna be this way or that way for me. I'm just gonna have to feel what the market a little bit more of if there's going to be inquiries for inquiries of have more weddings or if I raise my prices going to be lower. I don't know. It's very hard to know.
[00:43:28] Speaker A: It is hard. Well, it's probably impossible to know without trying. But at the same time I do think it's really interesting because since I work with so many photographers, I know how many of them are interested in adding on video because they think like, oh, it's another source of income, it's another thing to do. And to me I would say, no, go the other way. Not because I'm saying don't do video, but don't add on video because you think that's going to make you more money. You're not going to be more booked because you only have the time that you have. So adding on another thing that's kind of competing with yourself, that's not really going to help. And from what I understand, without having done video myself, it's completely different. So you're going to need probably a lot more equipment. You're going to need to learn a completely different skill set. And the post processing is a big thing on its own. How do you feel about all of that? Do you think it's just adding on video is an easy thing to do?
[00:44:29] Speaker B: No. I mean, we can refer to it or not. I mean, if you would have thought of adding video, you would have seen the same issues that Engvid is talking about, right?
[00:44:37] Speaker C: Definitely. I would never do that. Like seeing you work in DaVinci Resolve, the editing program. Okay, yeah, you could do Premiere Pro, whatever. But that is not easy. Like, or if you have to learn it, of course, then probably it's easier. But it's just so many more steps. It's just way more.
It's different. I have done some like small videos of like my Friends and their children, like, doing, like, small home sessions. And that's just been, like, a fun, creative thing. It's nothing like professional. I would never do that for a wedding. It's just. But it has been fun. And it's like trying out, see what works, how different it is. I would definitely not just, like, I'll try it out. Let's just, like, see what I can do on a wedding day. I would be like, okay, I know my settings. I know what works. Like, what kind of shutter speed I need for this in this scenario. Like, how these frame. What is it called? Frame.
[00:45:38] Speaker B: The frame rate.
[00:45:39] Speaker C: The frame rates. There's so many other terms and things you need to learn before going out.
[00:45:44] Speaker B: But I think that the thing that you touched on here, like, a lot of people trying on this videography thing, because it looks easy, and I find that, like, very interesting to see as well, because, I mean, from my perspective, it was never easy from the start because I had to learn cameras at the same time. I learned video at a very late stage. I guess I'm old, but.
But coming from a technical background as a music producer and technician, obviously, it kind of made more sense, maybe. But the whole thing of other people thinking that this is something they can offer, I think it's kind of confusing as well for different couples. I think it's very confusing for a lot of people. Who wants to. Oh, we want video as well. Could you do that for the last little bit that we have in our budget? Like, no, we cannot. You're going to have to ask your uncle or something to bring out an iPhone, because that's what it's going to be like.
[00:46:44] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:46:44] Speaker B: You're sitting there with footage. Like, I come home and I empty all my. My card slots, and I sit there with, like, I don't know, 14, 128 gigabyte cards. And that's, like, from different recorders, memory cards from the sound recorders, memory cards from the videos. And there's so many different things. And plus the backups, obviously, because it is the very important moments that you want to capture, and you don't want to just capture in one angle. Because videographers, we're stupid. We want to have, like, different angles. So you want to make it look like you have, like, a Philippine crew of seven people.
[00:47:22] Speaker C: You should, like, you're three people at work.
[00:47:24] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:47:25] Speaker C: So. But we have to talk about, like, there are videographers that also are doing, like, one camera and are doing, like, I don't know what sound settings you have, but that can also work. We're not saying you have to have three cameras. You have to do this, you have to do that.
[00:47:41] Speaker B: It's because I think the documentary style.
[00:47:44] Speaker C: Definitely that is more accepted now. It doesn't have to look as cinematic as it maybe had to before.
Just the documentary style of it is very popular at the moment. So that can also be a good thing to get started out. But I would never do both. Or at least you have to set aside time if you're learning both skills. I don't think it's going to be a very good transition through both of them. I would definitely recommend either hiring someone in your team or find somebody who already does it and team up with them.
You can also make a profit if you're hiring in someone if you're looking to have a bigger profit. But.
[00:48:33] Speaker B: Yeah, but you can see, like, the technical side of it, like, how much development there's been on photo versus video.
[00:48:41] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:48:42] Speaker B: Made a huge impact as well on what the people are expecting, like what couple think that they're going to be getting.
[00:48:50] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:48:51] Speaker B: So if you have an old camera. Yeah. You're not going to compete with people who. With their iPhones, maybe, in a way. But it comes down to the photography, obviously, what kind of things you're looking for. But when it comes to video, I mean, there's. There's a lot stuff going on in the editing side of it. It's just going to tell much more. The. The feeling, the story, making that vibe, creating it with. Together with music, with the speeches, how you mix the voice. It's just going to take a huge turn. If you lower down the voice too much, like, that's going to be like, oh, my God, that's. That the whole video sucks. Yes. Because the voice was turned down.
[00:49:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:49:29] Speaker B: There's so many different parts. You can just take the whole thing down.
[00:49:33] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:49:33] Speaker C: The sound is like just a whole different thing of itself.
[00:49:36] Speaker B: Oh, yeah.
[00:49:37] Speaker C: I mean, to get a sound image that looks good or sounds good.
[00:49:41] Speaker B: Yeah. And then you have to think about, like, okay, if you're gonna use different songs in a video, a wedding video.
I mean, something that really grinds me. It's like when I hear people using different keys, different music keys of the songs and trying to blend them together. I get like, oh, my God.
So I need to hear like, okay, this is a cohesive thing. So you're basically blending. You know, when you were younger, you can hear, like the next song on the album, the CDs. You can almost prepare yourself for it because you Know which kind of thing that was something that producers made with something in mind. They had an idea. So you have this kind of interval, so you can work with different keys and everything to tell the story even more further down that music line. So your whole wedding day feels like a cool mix of music and emotions and everything. And that's fun to edit.
[00:50:34] Speaker A: Yeah. And, well, the more that you talk about this, the more I realize that there's so much to videography that I'm sure that most people who are considering it have no idea about. So I'm really glad that you're mentioning it. But the other positive thing, I think, with the fact that a lot of people are considering video is that that must mean that there are more people interested in video. So hopefully video is on the rise, which is really good, because video is. I mean, the memories are, as we've already discussed, it's completely different from a photo to a video.
[00:51:10] Speaker B: But it's tricky to hire a videographer, I think. In what way? I think that if you. If I were to hire a photographer, I would be able to see what kind of style and everything based on maybe fewer variables than the videographer. So. And the videographer can also be like, okay, what kind of venue are you using? Do they have great lighting or not? I mean, we're not usually working with raw files, which a photographer would be very used to, I guess.
[00:51:41] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:51:42] Speaker B: So you can have some errors and faults in what you're doing and then get that back, basically. And it's harder to do in video.
[00:51:50] Speaker A: Oh, is it?
[00:51:51] Speaker B: Yeah, like you said before, like, if you get somebody in the shot, it's not gonna be there.
You don't want to sit and work two hours on one clip, like trying to do some Marvel VFX stuff. Right. So it's just going to be much more like you trying to document as much as possible for me as well, at least. And then trying to get the best parts of that and edit it together means compiling, compiling, compiling.
[00:52:14] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, so interesting.
[00:52:17] Speaker B: So it's hard. It's hard for people to know what they're getting. And that's why, like, I'm. I'm so impressed of people who wants to have a wedding video because of that. I'm so happy and impressed because of that.
[00:52:31] Speaker A: But do you think they know, in.
[00:52:32] Speaker B: My impression, is that they want to take a chance? They don't know. They don't have a clue what they're expecting. They don't have a clue. They don't know what the camera I'm going to be using, is it going to be like, what kind of vibe or anything? Obviously they've seen my films that I've done that are on my webpage, and that's going to be the only reference that. Does this look like it has a level of goodness?
[00:52:56] Speaker A: Quality.
[00:52:56] Speaker B: Yeah, quality. That's going to be enough for us to take a risk on this.
[00:53:01] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[00:53:02] Speaker B: But you don't know because, I mean, if you're documenting a whole wedding day on film and maybe the wedding goes to sideways, you don't want to be documenting that and getting the video out of that. Maybe.
[00:53:16] Speaker A: Yeah, no, it makes a lot of sense, but at the same time, it's such a huge area and I know so little about it. But I do feel like I'm understanding more both as to, like, how all the things you have to think about when you're doing video, not to mention the collaboration between a photographer and a videographer. Would you say that you have any, like, final tips for someone who is either a videographer working with a photographer or a photographer wanting to work with a videographer? Like, how can they collaborate better during a wedding day?
[00:53:55] Speaker C: I think you just need to talk in advance, have a meeting, talk about, like I said earlier, talk about your needs, what you want to get out of the day, how you like to work. Do you like to be in charge? Do you like to be more behind and let everybody else, like, do their thing and just, like, go along? Yeah, I think that's the main thing you need to do. And during the day, keep positive mindsets, don't get easily annoyed, have some grace to the other person.
Just be human and be aware that everybody is working for the same goal. We want the best for the couple.
At least I hope everybody's thinking that, as I think you should.
[00:54:43] Speaker B: You want the money.
[00:54:47] Speaker C: And just have understanding for each other. But I felt so many times like this is taking too long, working with Manet and getting stressed out. And I know that he has so many other things to think about, and I need to be like, okay, take a step back. He actually needs to do this. What can I do to help him in other ways, like doing something else with the couple or, like, not distract them, but, you know, what can I do to help the situation if he needs to set up things? How can we work together?
Mostly like a team? I know people prefer to work alone, people prefer to work in teams. We're all different in that way. But I feel like it's what the couple wants. We need to have that in mind.
[00:55:37] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:55:37] Speaker B: I think it's a great point as well that you're saying how you have to communicate to be setting up. Like, are we going to be collaborating or are we going to do our separate ways?
[00:55:46] Speaker C: And that's also, like, for couples who are hiring us, like, are they hiring really, like, two people with very different styles?
Do they choose a cheesy photographer or a videographer? Or do they choose, like, both documentary? And that's a big, big deal, because if Manuel is working with somebody who's like, all about stiff poses or not directing at all, it would look different than a video he would do with my couples.
[00:56:21] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, definitely.
[00:56:22] Speaker C: That also comes in mind. Like, then you have to step in, and then it would take longer. So that's kind of like, if you do are a team and working together more often, that's a huge plus. So you get to, like, you learn how you to fill in each other's needs, whatever. How can you work as smoothly together as possible?
That's my recommendation, at least.
[00:56:50] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Communication is key. Without talking together, without agreeing on how you're going to do it, it must be almost impossible to both enjoy the day and to get the results that you and the couple want.
[00:57:06] Speaker B: Luckily for me, I mean, the most photographers are already kind of established, so they have a very profound understanding of what's going to be happening on the day. And they can actually coordinate and everything as well. They have, like, they're on a plus margin while I'm feeling like I'm on a minus. So as long as, I mean, I don't go more on minus, I feel very happy working with photographers and having that kind of thing. But, like, I don't know what to say, like, having all these conversations beforehand and just decide, okay, are you cool with taking the couples to the posing thing, or do you have a time schedule? Have you discussed all these things? And we just do all the technical stuff beforehand and decide. I mean, for me, at least, I. I'm very fond of deciding beforehand with the photographer that who's going to be in charge and who is going to be communicating with the couple firsthand.
But obviously I see myself as an assistant with a video camera.
[00:58:02] Speaker C: Instead of the main character.
[00:58:03] Speaker B: You're just like, exactly.
But it's kind of fun to see the difference working with different photographers, obviously.
[00:58:11] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I would imagine it is very different, especially when you're so familiar with each other that working with someone else is probably very different.
[00:58:20] Speaker B: And we got to the point where we can actually do the Whole thing. Look. Just look.
[00:58:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:58:26] Speaker B: You know, which. Which kind of camera I'm looking at, talking about. I can just look at her and she knows exactly. Oh, yeah. I'm gonna have to set it on the second step of the dual native ISO and then take down the variable ND filter a little bit. Yes.
Couple goals.
[00:58:42] Speaker A: Yeah, that's. That's excellent. I love that. That's perfect. A question I usually end with is about sustainability. Do you have any thoughts or even advice as to what someone can do to make their business more sustainable or if there's something that is important for you to have a sustainable business?
[00:59:04] Speaker C: I'll go first. Like, I think that a sustainable business is a business that has prices, that resonates with what you want to earn. Within weddings.
As a vendor, I think you need to find the couples you like to work with.
In the way I'm marketing, I want people who want, like, the real moments and not stiff poses. And I feel like I'm.
I want to show that so they get in touch with me. So I work with people I love working with. If I don't, I would. I would not like my job very much. So I think that's an important aspect as well. Finding people you want to work with and also have a healthy life. Balance, work system not working 24 7. I've done that myself. Being on the edge of burnout, it's not a fun place to be. So really take that seriously. Even though it's really, really hard.
[01:00:08] Speaker B: Yeah, well, yeah. And when it comes to, like, the sustainability of a videographer and wedding business, I think it's.
It's probably just marketing. Marketing, exactly. Like Renata said, marketing all these things that you want people to notice about you and in the way that you are. And it's kind of tricky to, I think, fake it.
I think it's very tricky to fake it when it comes to videography. I mean, there's a lot of different shortcuts, obviously, but I think in the beginning as well, it's all about getting those reps in, I think getting to understand what you're comfortable working with and not so you get that balance and then sustainability. Economically, I think it's very tricky, but I would say just hang in there and maybe working with other things as well. If you just can't do just weddings. But obviously there's a lot of people going abroad as well, doing those things. We know Norway has a lot of people who wants to get married in different places, and they want to rather maybe just bring along somebody but it comes to where you find your clients and what their perspective of the investment is. So that's a huge job for everybody to work with and just following along what the market is saying as well.
[01:01:32] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I couldn't agree more.
It's true. You have to, you have to pay attention to what's happening. And if something isn't working for you, maybe it's time to test something new and to tweak it so that it is working. You can't just stop and say like, oh, well, it's not working anymore. There's nothing I can do.
[01:01:51] Speaker B: Yeah, I think especially with video, there's so many different routes to take. You're not just delivering an album, a digital album or a physical album, you actually delivering different kind of formats. Yeah, so you have like the. I mean, they're hiring social media videographers now to go along with the video team. So you have somebody who's just dedicated to do the social media. So they posting everything straight away, like.
[01:02:14] Speaker A: For, for normal people or for like influencers?
[01:02:17] Speaker B: No, no, for normal people. I mean, they have like the photographer, they have the videographer and they have somebody who's coming along just for doing the post, you know, of the social media during the day. So they're actually just updating everything with the reels and everything all the time. And they have their hashtags and everything. So I mean, that's a different format, obviously.
So if you, I mean, something that I would go for is to have a business where I know people who can give the idea to the couple of something that they really would like to see the value of, which would be really cool to do. So. Yeah, getting all these different formats. I mean, they want to have like the, the long video, they want to have the highlight video which is not so popular anymore. Now they want to have like a 20 minute mini documentary thing. And then there's like the huge one hour, one and a half hour thing as well. And I would say that it came to my biggest surprise how much value there is in the one hour documentary thing.
Because when you sit there like five or ten years afterwards and the highlight movie is just not enough, then you want to see like you see the highlight movie. Yeah, that was cool. Everything's fine. We saw five minutes of our wedding. The whole day, the whole preparation, everything, five minutes done. Now we want to see all the speeches. Now we want to see the ceremony from the, the perspective of the audience. Now we want to see like all the things that the photographer and the videographer captured during the day. That's going to take an hour. It's fine. So I said that that's a different kind of angle to the whole thing as well. What you can do to make it more sustainability is like try to figure out different kind of formats you can deliver and try to make that as an idea for the couple of what. What they would like to see more than just buying a product.
[01:04:02] Speaker A: Yeah, no, that's. That's a great idea. And I think it's also a really good reminder that there's so many ways of doing both video and photography. Like, there's so much you can do. So I think that's really good for people to just be like, okay, so I don't have to do this one thing that I maybe don't enjoy as much. There's another way.
Yeah, yeah.
[01:04:24] Speaker B: I mean, it's like with the printing and everything, I guess with the photography thing, you can do the prints. You can do like very creative stuff with that too, with the albums and everything for the couples too, so they have like their memories treasured even more.
[01:04:37] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. You can do slideshows and you can do GIFs and you can do prints and albums. Like there are so many things.
Yeah, absolutely. And we've been talking for about an hour and I'm sure that the people who are listening are curious to see your videos and to see your photos. Renate, where can they go?
[01:04:59] Speaker C: My handle on Instagram is renatematsenphotography and my website is renatematsenpunk.com.
[01:05:07] Speaker B: Yeah, mine is all of the handleless films by Madsen with a D. Madsen and the webpage is films by Madsen.com.
[01:05:18] Speaker A: I will definitely link to all of those in the show notes so that people can check it out.
[01:05:22] Speaker B: Thank you. We appreciate it.
[01:05:23] Speaker C: Great.
[01:05:24] Speaker A: Yeah. Thank you so much for doing this talk. I think it's really eye opening both for me and I'm sure for everyone who's listening to just see, learn a bit more about videography, but also how to play nicer together with your photographer and videographer when you're collaborating at a wedding.
[01:05:43] Speaker C: Yeah. Thank you for having us.
[01:05:45] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. It's an eye opener for us as well. Sounds really good. Thank you so much.
[01:05:50] Speaker A: Thank you.
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